Bob-James is an interdisciplinary arts and cultural management professional whose work sits at the intersection of fashion, art, cultural identity, and decolonial practice. His career spans fashion, marketing, audience engagement, and the performing arts, with experience at organizations including SSENSE, Sheertex, Gravitas, Acumen & Co, and I Musici de Montréal.
Bob-James holds a degree in Art History with a minor in Economics from Concordia University, a degree in Marketing Management from Université de Montréal, a Certificate in Fashion Communication from Central Saint Martins, and a Master’s of Management in International Arts Management (MMIAM) from HEC Montréal, SMU Dallas, and SDA Bocconi.
It’s been a while since we saw each other in Dallas—you’ve traveled with MMIAM and completed the program! Tell me what you’ve been up to since graduation?
I’ve been doing some independent research; a continuation of the work I started during the MMIAM program, actually.
How did that get started?
Well, we were actually still in classes. I was nowhere near done with my thesis, but I saw this LinkedIn post from one of our teachers, Danilo Dantas, that was like, ‘Hey, so, there’s this arts management conference (AIMAC) happening next year in Brazil, and we’re starting the call for papers.’ I saw that post, and I was just like, ‘Okay, one thing at a time. Let’s focus on finishing this program.’
And that’s what happened. I finished in late August and came back to Montréal in early September. I think I sent an email right away to my thesis supervisor, Professor Andrea Rurale, and Danilo—two separate emails—asking about the conference. I thought they wanted PhD students or candidates, and I, obviously, don’t have a PhD. So, I was wondering if I could still be a part of it; if I should even bother applying. I had so many questions, but Danilo encouraged me to apply. Andrea was also really encouraging. He told me that he thought my topic—my thesis was called TRANSLATING STYLE TO SYMBOL: Weaving Black Identity and Decolonial Futures Through Fashion Artification—was interesting and that it would be good to apply, but warned me that what I wrote was definitely a master’s thesis, not an academic paper ready for presentation, and that I would need to do more work.
Around the same time, I applied for funding. In Quebec, if you’re under 35 years old and you want to do a project abroad, you can apply for funding through Les Offices jeunesse internationaux du Québec (LOJIQ) that will cover some portion of your experience—your stay, your airline ticket, etc. So I applied, got the funding, and put it towards the AIMAC conference.
Let’s step back for a second. Can you break that down for me? What is artification?
Artification is the transformation of an object into an art object. My thesis is specifically about fashion artification, so transforming a fashion item into an art object. I wrote about how fashion artification can be used as a decolonial tool in the museum. I used an exhibition at the Met Museum, Super Fine: Tailoring Black Style, as my case study. So, I was arguing that fashion by Black fashion designers, once it’s artified, is a decolonizing tool for the museum and that style is transformed into something more symbolic than just fashion.
I think of fashion as an art form, inherently. Do you believe that fashion has to go through this artification first?
I believe so as well; fashion is definitely an art form. So what’s interesting is that historically, it hasn’t always been the case. Because fashion is so accessible, it loses a bit of prestige. I’m not talking about high fashion or haute couture here, but rather, because of its utility, we tend not to consider fashion as an art form in general, especially when the people behind said fashion are Black. I personally don’t believe that fashion needs to be placed in a museum to be considered a piece of art, BUT it was interesting for me to explore that academically and to hear different perspectives.
Some of Thierry Mugler’s creations at Montréal Museum of Fine Arts in February 2019 as shot by Bob-James. Credit: Personal archive.
So, how did you go about transforming the thesis?
Andrea told me I needed a new angle, and this angle became a comparison. I began looking at the Montréal Museum of Fine Arts (MMFA) also, comparing what I call “non-dedicated” museums. These museums are not exclusively dealing with fashion or textiles, but they have hosted fashion exhibitions. When I was doing my research, I remembered that the MMFA had recently hosted the exhibition Thierry Mugler: Couturissime, and to my surprise, it was the most attended exhibition in Canada that year.
Oh, wow!
And also, Super Fine had broken attendance records in New York, I believe.
So, I interviewed Thierry-Maxime Loriot, the curator of the exhibition in Montréal; Dr. Jonathan M. Square, who was part of the consulting team for the exhibition in New York; and Nadia Banyan, a local independent curator who provided exhibition material that really resonated with what I was researching. She curated an exhibition called Aunties’ Work: The Power of Care at the McCord Stewart Museum here in Montréal. It focused on the power of community; it was very moving. The items exhibited were also very inclusive of material culture.
I then conducted a survey that did not get good results. This was actually feedback I got after presenting—I should have had more quantitative data coming from the survey. I think I had maybe 50 responses total. It was not enough.
Surveying is tough. Tell me about the conclusions you drew from all of your research.
So I was looking at all of these sources, and what I theorized was that artification is a spectrum. There’s not one way to do this, but multiple. The two exhibitions I’ve highlighted are based on aesthetic artification, which relies on spectacle, and decolonial artification, which relies on history.
With Super Fine, at The Met, it was like, ‘Yes, we are highlighting Black designers, but also, here’s a coat, top hat, and cane that belonged to Frederick Douglass and here’s an 1864 painting by Edward Troye that highlights Black Jockeys and has been exhibited beside an outfit that would’ve been worn by Black Jockeys at the time, in conversation with contemporary designs inspired by sportswear. It was history, mixed with modernity, that made it what it was. That made it impactful, right?
And in the interview that I did with Dr. Square, we talked about how artification can be hard, because once you remove it from its context, it just makes no sense, right? For example, a leotard worn by a dancer at the Alvin Ailey American Dance Theater, you know, something that’s very historically important; if you just put it on a mannequin or a hanger, it just looks like a piece of fabric. So, it’s a good thing to have fashion in the museum, but it’s important to understand it might lose its meaning in that process. And with some objects, it might lose its political importance. You have to be careful.
With the Mugler—I saw it twice in Montréal, because it was just so popular—this exhibition that traveled around the world, I saw it very much as a spectacle, especially the way the scenography was done; it was very akin to that. The exhibition was presented like, ‘Oh, here is this Mugler dress and here is a photo of Madonna wearing that dress, and here is Beyoncé in her Diva (2008) music video wearing this Mugler bodysuit-armour situation.’ But when I talked to the curator, he told me it was more political than meets the eye. He also said that it’s the audience’s responsibility to be aware of the political aspect of the designs. Thierry Mugler himself, in the process of putting together the exhibition along with the curator, stated that his inspiration was female liberation in conversation with the political protests happening in Paris in May 1968, and when you know that, you kind of look at the clothes and you’re like, ‘Okay, I see it.’ You can see how these pieces are meant to challenge this extreme idea of glamour and femininity while still being glamorous. I think it’s hard, at least for me, to make that specific connection right away. But he was saying that fashion is inherently political, as is having fashion pieces in a museum, but it was ultimately the audience’s responsibility to be cognizant of that.
Finally, in my interview with Nadia, we discussed whether artification needs the museum. She believes that artification, if it refers to certain communities, should be embraced by said communities, rather than institutions. She said that even her own exhibition, Aunties’ Work, could have taken place in a grass field, in a parking lot, in a garage, wherever, as long as the people that she is representing within the exhibition feel represented and represented correctly. So if we look at, for example, the show in New York, did Black Americans specifically feel accurately represented and feel like this is a good depiction of their history, their stylistic story throughout the years? If so, then that’s where the win lies, whereas attendance is just not the indicator of success. At least for her.
I think it was interesting to kind of have these perspectives in discussion with one another.
Bob-James presenting his research in Brazil as part of the AIMAC Rio 2026 Conference.
So, what does that mean for our field? You said that artification can be a tool for decolonization. Do you believe then that museums should be opening more Black and people of color shows? How can we ensure that the right people are in the right places—curatorial, museum leadership, etc. to do this work well?
I think what it means concretely for arts management, and for the world in general, is that people yearn for novelty in the arts and are open to non-traditional art forms from people that haven’t always been (accurately) represented. I think going to a textile or fashion museum in order to see an exhibition is different than going to a fine arts museum and seeing a fashion exhibition. Fashion, in the art world at least, is more democratic and less intimidating to an audience, so they will not feel like an “outsider” if they go see a fashion exhibition. If artification can make historically marginalized communities more visible and accessible within museum spaces, then arts managers have to think not only about what gets artified, but who has the authority to make those decisions.
I also think that a good example of that would be the MET. What they did well is have Monica L. Miller, a Black woman and author of the 2009 book that inspired the exhibition, Slaves to Fashion: Black Dandyism and the Styling of Black Diasporic Identity, as a guest curator. They had Torkwase Dyson, another Black woman, as set designer for the exhibition. They had Tanda Francis, another Black woman, designing the mannequins for the exhibition. I could go on and on, but what I am saying is decolonization is not only about what we see, but the team behind what we see. To put together an exhibition, a play, a concert, or really anything that showcases Black / POC artists and their work, you have to make sure that the people behind it accurately understand and advocate for the people being represented. While I do believe that museums should open more Black / POC shows, believe that it should be done with intent, and the research should be done to find the right people. Arts managers therefore have a responsibility to think critically about hiring, curatorial partnerships, and decision-making structures. Instead of bringing in Black / POC only AFTER the exhibition concept has already been established to sort of “co-sign” the whole thing, museums should involve them from the beginning and give them real authority over how the work is researched, analyzed, interpreted, and presented.
A bad example of that would be Paris Noir presented at the Centre Pompidou last year… but that’s another conversation for another day haha.
What, if anything, are you doing with the research that you presented right now?
Ideally, in the short term, I’ll get to publish it. That being said, there are multiple steps before then. I have to find the right publication, and I have to apply all the constructive feedback I received at AIMAC AND get more people to fill in my survey haha; so that will take a bit of time. I also want to say my short-term goal is getting a PhD. Academia is challenging but not unattainable. This experience solidified that that’s where my future is headed. The MMIAM program helped me with this.
How so?
I’m looking for a PhD program that would welcome my research and where I could grow the best. And because of this conference, I met so many people from all over the world who were very encouraging, told me about their journeys, about their universities, and about the work they’re able to do concretely with this level of education. It’s good to know what’s out there and definitely motivating.
In terms of broadening my horizons, the MMIAM was my first time being away for so long. I left Montréal in mid-August, and by the end of October, that’s kind of where I reached my point of, like, ‘Oh, my God, I need to go home like yesterday.’ It was very difficult. But looking back, it was good. It made me grow; toughened me up a bit.
It was a very necessary period of my life, and I don’t think I would have opened myself up to so many different options and opportunities had I not completed the MMIAM.
Bob-James and some of his MMIAM classmates in Bogotá, Colombia, in 2025. Credit: personal archive.
*Bob-James’s headshot credit: Noire Mouliom.